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Kong76

I don't know if this was posted in the regular forum, but 2005 is live and
ready to be picked apart if anyone is interested. Hint Hint

http://www.baseball-reference.com/teams/NYM/2005.shtml

OE: I changed the subject so this can just be the 2005 thread.

dgwphotography · Posted: Fri Oct 14, 2005 7:33 pm Post subject:

ok - give me a few days - I'll start crunching the numbers, make a list, and check it twice...
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Kong76 · Posted: Fri Oct 14, 2005 9:17 pm Post subject:

I wasn't singling anyone out - I have more half finished projects than anyone
to be doing that. I just thought a few people might want to start looking at 'em.

Valadius · Posted: Fri Oct 14, 2005 9:32 pm Post subject:

I can't wait to be a part of this. How is this done each year?
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Kong76 · Posted: Fri Oct 14, 2005 9:57 pm Post subject:

>>>How is this done each year?<<<

I knew there was a reason I saved the ranking threads and restored them here.

Edgy DC · Posted: Fri Oct 14, 2005 11:20 pm Post subject:

Rank the top 30 Mets from 2005. Simple as that. The other information can be found in the thread atop this forum. With other detours found strewn about.

Kong76 · Posted: Sat Oct 15, 2005 9:51 am Post subject:

Certainly you can afford me a tiny bit of sarcasm, Edge - there are forty-one
example years to weed through.

Frayed Knot · Posted: Sat Oct 15, 2005 10:01 am Post subject:

Frayed Knot · Posted: Sat Oct 15, 2005 10:16 am Post subject:

Here's where I'd like to kick off the discussion;
I think it's pretty clear that Wright & Floyd were the best offensive players. The question is; in which order?

Wright led Cliff in
runs scored: 99 to 85; RBI: 102 - 98; 2Bs: 42 - 22; BBs: 72 - 63
BA: .306 - ..273; OBA: .388 - .358; SLG: .523 - .505

Floyd his more HRs: 34 - 27, struck out less: 98 - 113;
stole better: 12 of 14 vs 17 of 24; and GiDP'd less: 5 vs 16 !

So why does my gut say that Floyd had the better season?
Well, for starters, it seems to me - and I'm always leery of baseball phrases that start "it seems to me" - that Cliff just got the bigger hits all year long, that he played better defense, that the lineup depended on him more, etc.

So go ahead, someone make an argument that backs me up on Floyd deseving the top spot (at least among non-pitchers) or, conversely, tell me why I'm all wet.
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Kong76 · Posted: Sat Oct 15, 2005 10:24 am Post subject:

Then someone chimes in and says that Wright had 28 win-shares vs. Floyds
26 so you don't know donkey doo. And then someone else says that win-
shares is nothing <i>but</i> donkey doo and didn't you watch any games?

ScarletKnight41 · Posted: Sat Oct 15, 2005 10:41 am Post subject:

Plus someone points out that Wright won the Crane Pool Schaeffer Player of the Year award, so that should carry some weight with the 2005 rankings.
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Kong76 · Posted: Sat Oct 15, 2005 11:47 am Post subject:

And he's better looking.

dgwphotography · Posted: Sat Oct 15, 2005 11:56 am Post subject:

My initial list has Floyd third behind Pedro and Wright.
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Willets Point · Posted: Sat Oct 15, 2005 11:56 am Post subject:

And appeals to New York's broad Caucausian demographic.
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Valadius · Posted: Sat Oct 15, 2005 1:10 pm Post subject:

Ok... time to begin my first foray into this hallowed process!

The first thing I would do is begin to lump players into four categories:

Major: Players who played a major role during the season
Supporting: Players who played a large supporting role during the season
Minor: Players who played a minor role during the season
Not Enough: Players we can disqualify immediately for not having much impact

So here is my grouping (in no particular order within the grouping unless otherwise noted):

Major

David Wright (1)
Cliff Floyd (2)
Pedro Martinez (3)
Jose Reyes (4)
Carlos Beltran
Mike Piazza
Kris Benson
Tom Glavine
Braden Looper
Victor Zambrano
Roberto Hernandez
Aaron Heilman
Mike Cameron
Victor Diaz
Mike Jacobs
Jae Seo

Supporting

Chris Woodward
Ramon Castro
Marlon Anderson
Doug Mientkiewicz
Juan Padilla
Kaz Ishii
Kazuo Matsui
Miguel Cairo

Minor

Steve Trachsel
Danny Graves
Dae Sung Koo
Heath Bell
Jose Offerman
Gerald Williams

Not Enough

Anderson Hernandez
Tim Hamulack
Mike DiFelice
Brian Daubach
Felix Heredia
Eric Valent
Mike Matthews
Mike DeJean
Jose Santiago
Manny Aybar
Shingo Takatsu
Royce Ring

Can we agree upon the twelve players I have listed as "Not Enough" as the players we exclude from the rankings?
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"Buy the ticket, take the ride" -- Dr. Hunter S. Thompson

"We hope that Golf Your Way will be a unique instructional period for each of you out there who’s a goddamn fucking bad golfer like me." -- Bobby Knight

Benjamin Grimm · Posted: Sat Oct 15, 2005 1:43 pm Post subject:

All you have to do is list your personal Top 30. Everyone else will do theirs, and thus the consensus rankings are formed.

Valadius · Posted: Sat Oct 15, 2005 2:18 pm Post subject:

If you insist:

1. David Wright
2. Cliff Floyd
3. Pedro Martinez
4. Jose Reyes
5. Carlos Beltran
6. Tom Glavine
7. Mike Piazza
8. Kris Benson
9. Mike Cameron
10. Victor Zambrano
11. Roberto Hernandez
12. Victor Diaz
13. Jae Seo
14. Mike Jacobs
15. Braden Looper
16. Aaron Heilman
17. Ramon Castro
18. Kazuo Matsui
19. Marlon Anderson
20. Chris Woodward
21. Doug Mientkiewicz
22. Miguel Cairo
23. Juan Padilla
24. Kaz Ishii
25. Heath Bell
26. Steve Trachsel
27. Jose Offerman
28. Dae Sung Koo
29. Gerald Williams
30. Danny Graves
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"Buy the ticket, take the ride" -- Dr. Hunter S. Thompson

"We hope that Golf Your Way will be a unique instructional period for each of you out there who’s a goddamn fucking bad golfer like me." -- Bobby Knight

Kong76 · Posted: Sat Oct 15, 2005 4:41 pm Post subject:

He's not insisting, that's just the way all the years were done. Read some of
the threads, some of them are pretty entertaining (well, to a Mets geek). Some
years didn't get a lot of action because of apathy or the initial poster just nailed
the rankings so well there wasn't much to argue about.

Nymr83 · Posted: Mon Oct 24, 2005 6:43 pm Post subject:

ok i'm working on this now to stay away from my casebooks for a few minutes...
my method for first hitters: OPS+ multiplied by plate appearences. players with a negative OPS+ (there were 2) were given a "1" OPS+. i didn't like how this turned out at all, the disparity between certain players were strange.

next i tried (OPS+ * PA) - (100-OPS+ * (1/4)PA) this was done because an ops+ under 100 is generally not somethig you want and the further under you go the worse off you are. this also added to those with OPS+ scores over 100

this got the met hitters into an order that i felt almost comfotable with:

wright, floyd, beltran, reyes, piazza, cameron (,) diaz, mientkiewicz, jacobs, castro, anderson, matsui, woodward, cairo, offerman, valent, williams, daubach, hernandez, difelice.

i think my problem now is 3 things: offense other than what is measured by OPS+ (ie reyes on the basepaths), difficulty of defensive position, & how good that defense actually was. a combination of these factors (which i dont have numbers i trust for) makes me want to bump reyes ahead of beltran, i'll also push woodward ahead of matsui.
when i do the pitchers i'll need to kick a few hitters out entirely, the last 3 (daubach, hernandez, defelice) will definetaly go. valent and williams are question marks for now, offerman and higher will almost definetaly stay...

i'll edit this or post my complete list when i do the pitchers, edgy if you care whether i edit/post again let me know.
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Valadius · Posted: Wed Nov 02, 2005 1:17 pm Post subject:

Are we gonna keep going with this or are we waiting until after the song parody contest?
_________________
"Buy the ticket, take the ride" -- Dr. Hunter S. Thompson

"We hope that Golf Your Way will be a unique instructional period for each of you out there who’s a goddamn fucking bad golfer like me." -- Bobby Knight